Special Edition: Bridging Worlds Through Conversation

As the warm breeze of KwaZulu-Natal brushes against my skin, I, Shireen, team up with Tanya, soaking in the Miami sun, to unravel the colorful threads of cultural communication that connect us all. Our laughter echoes through stories of seasonal contrasts and the amusing confusions that spring from using different units of measure. We're diving into a conversation that's as much about the climates we cherish as it is about the disparities and privileges that shape our lives. Imagine navigating a world where Celsius meets Fahrenheit, and personal histories blend into a shared narrative on how we perceive and engage with the world around us.

Tanya Scotece

• Email: tanya8828@aol.com
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanya-scotece-ph-d-lfd-cfsp-%E2%80%9Cdr-t%E2%80%9D-a85a6226/
• Tel: +1 941-387-6485

Shireen Botha

• Email: tanya8828@aol.com
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shireenbotha/
• Tel: +1 239 444 8638

This exchange blossoms into a profound discussion about the art of conversation and the way it's sculpted by our upbringing and the digital age's ever-changing communication platforms. From the subtleties of WhatsApp etiquette to the deeper implications of family dynamics on dialogue, we're peeling back layers to reveal the core of human interaction. We also confront the roots of our reactions, examining how core beliefs and personal triggers can color our professional exchanges. Join us, as we offer not just reflections but strategies, for fostering personal growth and navigating the delicate dance of conversation in both our personal and professional lives.

Buzzsprout - Let's get your podcast launched!
Start for FREE

Disclaimer: This post contains affiliate links. If you make a purchase, I may receive a commission at no extra cost to you.

Transcript

Voiceover: 0:03

Tales from the Wild, stories from the Heart A journey into the mind and soul of fired-up business professionals, where they share their vision for the future and hear from a different non-profit organization every month as they create awareness of their goals and their needs. Dive into a world of untamed passion. As we join our host, Shireen Botha, for this month's episode of Friends from Wild Places.

Shireen Botha: 0:36

Good morning, good day, wild Hearts, Shireen here I'm your podcast's bookkeeper and QuickBooks advisor. What I always say is, if you're looking for a bookkeeper, firstly know exactly what you're looking for. Know what personality best suits you. Are you looking to just hand your financial records over to someone and not hear from them again unless necessary? Or are you looking for someone who has full transparency and open communication, someone that takes the time to get to know the fingerprint of your business and builds a relationship with you on a daily basis? Well then, I am probably the bookkeeper for you. Call Shireen's Bookkeeping Services today and, if you want to know more, go check me out at www. shireensbookkeeping. com and allow me to keep your books clean so you don't have to. Welcome back. You are listening to Friends from Wild Places with myself, Shireen, and my awesome and fantastic co-host, Tanya. What is happening in your life today, Tanya?

Tanya Scotece: 1:51

Well, good morning, good afternoon or good evening to our listeners and to you, Shireen.

Tanya Scotece: 1:57

So I know you are calling in from South Africa and I'm here calling in from Miami, Florida, United States, and today we are just here to have a Saturday morning chat and I just am really super excited to really dive into the cultural differences, right, just being women, having celebrated International Women's Day and I know that was a conversation that you had so I thought today would be a great opportunity to maybe just even get to know what it's like in your part of the world, maybe some of the similarities, some of the differences.

Tanya Scotece: 2:37

So that's what this morning's podcast is all about. So, to answer your question, Shireen, so in Miami right now, obviously with August, we are getting ready for back to school, right, and the climate here is in most parts of the United States it's summertime, so very hot. I learned recently the San Diego is on the verge of getting a hurricane and that's uncommon. Those are more popular here in Florida, and September is actually that time of year for us with hurricanes. So just wanted to start with, in your part of the world, Shireen, what's it like for you right now, in August 2023? What climate are you in? What's the season like in South Africa?

Shireen Botha: 3:24

Well, thanks for the question. First of all, our seasons are completely opposite to you guys, though our weather is very similar to Florida weather. I live in Kwazulu- Natal, the province of the land of the Zulus where King Shaka this was his home. So if you know anything about history, you would know about King Shaka and the Zulus. This specific province gets it's very similar weather to Florida, so very high humidity and, especially in the summer, and very hot weather. It's pretty constant throughout the year. We don't really get very cold days. I think the coldest day that we can get, if I can think about it's probably 15, 14 degrees. I know at the lowest one we got was 11 degrees Celsius. This time winter, which is not. That's not normal. So that's quite cold, but normally it's very throughout the year, pretty either very hot or warm weather.

Tanya Scotece: 4:39

So we are actually exiting our winter time now and first of September will be the first day of spring for us Completely opposite, completely opposite of us here, and I already heard one difference, because in the States, most commonly, unless someone's in the science field, we use Fahrenheit, yes, to describe. So it's interesting, even just in communication, for what kind of weather and what kind of temperature. You know, and I know a lot of friends from the European countries also use the Celsius.

Shireen Botha: 5:15

So very interesting. Yeah, yeah, and the metrics as opposed to miles, and so we do kilometers and all that. It's very interesting.

Tanya Scotece: 5:25

Right, right. So, Shireen, tell us I know we've had, you know, quite a few podcasts together previously for me as your guest and then, most recently, as your co-host. So describe a little bit like your upbringing. So you were born in South Africa, right? And what was it like for you, like growing up, like you know what kind of you know, what was your childhood experience?

Shireen Botha: 5:50

Okay, so I was born in a town called Port Elizabeth, which is actually in the Eastern Cape, if my geography is correct. If it's not, I'm sure the listeners that are from South Africa are going to be screaming at the speakers that, yeah, a little town called Port Elizabeth. We moved to Johannesburg when I was very young and stayed there for a while, and then from there we moved down to the coast, which is here. When I say the coast is Kwazulu- Natal, which is currently the position that I'm in now in my childhood home with my parents, which I moved back in with them in February of this year.

Shireen Botha: 6:45

So my childhood I don't remember a lot of it, but it was overall, I think, very. I think you know it was a very good childhood in the sense of I got a lot of opportunity that I think thousands of people did not get. I got an awesome education and you know every. You know my parents put me through not only school but had food on the table every day. I was able to grow up in a privileged household, in the sense of I got more than what the normal person would get.

Shireen Botha: 7:37

I don't know exactly what I mean by that, because our family was just a very mediocre salary, earning family, you know, but still and I'm basing my response to the thousands of people in my country that have no jobs and the thousands and almost two millions of children that are growing up without an education, so that is a lot in this country. And so one would definitely look at my family and go, wow, you know, you, you had a lot growing up and I did, I did, and I'm not denying that. So I'm very thankful and I'm very grateful for that. My parents put me through school. They let me go overseas when I was 16 years old. Yeah, so to answer your question, I have been very blessed.

Tanya Scotece: 8:42

Yes, yes, that's awesome. That's awesome. I love South Africa and I hear it like I want to look, let's say preface the listeners with. When we discuss things, everything is relative to our perspective and our situation, right? So, for example, like the spectrum, so like what I'm hearing you say is from what you're describing, I would refer to that in the United States is like a middle class family.

Shireen Botha: 9:09

That's how we would refer to correct word to say yes.

Tanya Scotece: 9:13

Yeah, I myself to myself to. I grew up in Connecticut, right between New York and Boston Massachusetts up there. So Connecticut, very small state, and I was there primarily up until 2005. And then my family and I relocated to Florida. So you had described, you know, the education as far as having, you know, that opportunity.

Tanya Scotece: 9:38

And here in the States, you know, what's really interesting that I find is that educational opportunities are available right to all groups of people and yet a lot of people don't pursue education right off the bat, like and it's funny, like even myself, I mean, I was in my mid 30s when I went to a college. So I find it fascinating that some cultures right, I have a lot of friends from Indian culture and Asian cultures that were education is stressed like it's very important. Where I don't know, I mean in the United States sometimes it's like you have a lot of people that don't choose college as a path and that's okay to right, that's okay too. So, growing up in South Africa as a woman, what would you say was, you know, getting a job when you were of age? What is the age to work in in South Africa, here in the States, at 16.

Shireen Botha: 10:36

I think there's really a law about the age that you can start working. I think people, some people have to work. You know as young as you know younger teens just trying to to get a little waitressing job to to help the families. But yeah, about 16 sounds good. Hey, it sounds about accurate in the sense of when you can start working if that is the option or that is the, the choice that you want to take.

Tanya Scotece: 11:11

So yeah, so here in the States it's interesting because the age of 16 is when people can start working in a lot of jobs that people would default to at 16, maybe some office work jobs, the grocery stores, things of that nature. So what age did you actually start working like a page up? Because here, I don't know, is it common to do. Do you have babies sitting jobs where you watch younger children?

Shireen Botha: 11:41

I mean yeah, I mean definitely, I mean it's common as one would think, but it is definitely common. Listen to me, it's not as common as one thing, but it would be common. That's not normal Shireen talk. No, it's not. It's for me. I didn't start babysitting for someone until I became an all pair and went to the United States and looked after people's children there. But I have heard of people that do babysit there. You know their friends, kids or however. But for me, to answer your question, I started working when I was in school. I got my first job, I think when I was even grade 11 or grade 12, I think I was grade 11. And I had a waitressing job at a nursery next to the school that I was at. So yeah, interesting school.

Tanya Scotece: 12:44

It sounds like I mean, I don't know that much about the old pair opportunity job that you had, but that sounds like the official babysitter right Like.

Shireen Botha: 12:52

I don't know. That's it. Yes, 100%, that was the official. Becoming a nanny.

Tanya Scotece: 13:01

Wow, as you know, I don't have a TV, but I love watching, like Joe the nanny I don't know if you're familiar with like the YouTube episodes.

Shireen Botha: 13:10

Yes, the UK lady. Yes, the British lady. She is amazing, absolutely so good with children, with getting the parents in line. Yeah, yeah, she's really good yeah.

Tanya Scotece: 13:29

So you know. So it's what brings me to a point in our conversation that it's so fascinating from my perspective and I actually use Joe the nanny in teaching mortuary school. In some cases I will actually show YouTube's about communication, right, and I think that's what it's all about. It's what we are basing our own understanding, right, and I mean it's all about relationships with our marketing group B&I. We all have, you know, we all come in with different expertise in different areas and different subject matter, but the communication and the breakdown of communication, whether it be industry, workplace, personal relationships, interpersonal relationships, I mean I don't know, is the divorce rate high in South Africa, is it? I mean, the statistic here in the States is alarming, you know, and it's like you just wonder.

Tanya Scotece: 14:23

Like you know, people start off like people, whether it's an arranged marriage or people you know come together that they like each other and they seek out to, you know, have a relationship and get married. And then the communication something happens, right, like what is the turning point? That something happens that starts to break down, happens in business, happens in friendships, you know. So, from your perspective, how and what do you think like communication is taught? Is it taught in school or is it mostly just family? Because again, let's refer back to Joe the nanny. She goes into these homes. She doesn't know the family right and within a very short time she's able to assess and redirect Right and people follow it. It's like an amazing, like, all of a sudden, people who have been living together now can have a better relationship from an outsider Right. So what's your, what's your take on that? Shireen?

Shireen Botha: 15:21

Communication in general. Good question, very good question, Tanya. I think communication is not taught, and please understand this is through my point of view. In my eyes, you can get taught how to about the English language when you take the English in school, but that's not all. What that's not communication.

Shireen Botha: 15:50

Communication can come despite the language you speak. Communication is really important and if you don't learn different ways to communicate correctly, you can by all means take on really bad ways of communicating which can in turn sabotage your own relationships and hinder you from building correct relationships and so on and so forth. Even in your personal life, in your marriage, in your business, communication is a massive thing to actually survive life in general Unless you're going to be hiding under a rock and not planning to speak to anyone, which is sometimes how I feel like I would like to do Not communicate with anybody You've got to learn how to communicate. Yeah, I've had a really hard time with that growing up. In my life. Learning how to communicate correctly has been a very big challenge for me personally.

Shireen Botha: 17:10

In my personal life and you know, in life in general and in business life Something about English you can say one sentence but it can be taken in three or four different ways. So your intention of what you mean behind that one sentence could be taken in like four different ways, which is where miscommunication happens, and if you do not like, literally stipulate exactly what you're trying to say or the other party doesn't seek further in what you're trying to say, I'm sorry, Shireen, what did you mean by that? That's such a good sentence to have in your vocabulary.

Tanya Scotece: 17:58

Tanya. What did you mean by that? What did you mean by that? I'm going to write that one down, Shireen. Yeah, that is good. What did you mean by that? I'm hearing you correctly.

Shireen Botha: 18:07

Yeah, yeah, Very interesting, Right, instead of taking what you think the person meant and getting offended by what that person said, taking on like this, getting like hurt by what the person meant, building a resentment towards the person because you think this is what that person meant when they said this, Instead to try and avoid unnecessary things like that, asking Tonya, what did you mean by that when you said that, Kind of can help you avoid many unnecessary moments where you build up this resentment and it's not even worth it because later you find out oh no, Sherene, I didn't mean it like that at all.

Shireen Botha: 18:52

What I was trying to say was such and such and such. And then you've just spent and I don't know how long, but I mean you've just spent maybe a week or very upset with the person because you thought the person meant something completely different. So communication is a whole different ball game than just learning a language, not the same thing. And we are living in a world right now where communication is absolutely like horrid in general. And my, if you're watching right now, my camera is being playing up since the beginning of this podcast. I think it's these lights my head.

Tanya Scotece: 19:42

I love your hat. I love your hat. So the communication part, though, and again, we all grow up in our individual family units, and what we learn, right, even from a very young age, as a child whether things are spoken about in the home or not spoken about, or how we observe our families, brothers, sisters, parents, grandparents, and that's what is just normal, and it's not even a matter of like like. We don't even know if the communication that we're observing in our own household is positive, negative, good or bad. It's just what we observe, right?

Shireen Botha: 20:19

I mean it's exactly all the lack of.

Tanya Scotece: 20:25

Yeah, yeah, yeah, sorry, that's amazing. It's amazing, though, when we really like so, we see our parents how they communicate, and then we're getting you know into adulthood and now we're expected to you know if you have you know interpersonal relationships and find out like, okay, I'm not communicating, but I wish I had the communication skills now than when I was, you know, a younger girl, you know teenage girl, younger, younger, adult. I think we could do a better job as a country, as a world, of teaching communication early on, and not just language skills. Actually, you know understanding, basic, you know understanding of nature and, I think, the media, social media. And now, with what different ways that we communicate.

Tanya Scotece: 21:13

Right Back in the day it was just verbal or usually mailing a letter. Now we have email, we have text, we have all different types of ways you know that we are communicating. And the other thing that I find fascinating is what is the expected time for a response? Right, like with texting, texting is almost like people expect that you know that you're going to be available and responding to in that moment, when you could be in a different time zone on a plane, out of cell phone, but the expectation. So when people don't respond it's like oh, what did I do? Like the default is did somebody do something wrong?

Shireen Botha: 21:59

Oh my gosh, it is. And I mean I used to. You know I used to. It doesn't really bother me much anymore, but I remember a time that when you would open up my letter. So there's again. I've got to remember again. We're talking about different countries now and WhatsApp is an app that we've been using for messaging system for many, many years. And I think WhatsApp has now recently come into Florida, because there's a lot of people that are using it and that's not, but there's not as many that are using it in California, which is the West Coast. So yeah, so WhatsApp is 100% quite a big communication messaging system and when you open the message, it shows a blue tick to the person on the other side that sent you the message. So you know as a person, the sender, you know when the person has read your message or not. I used to get so mad if you blue ticked me. If you blue ticked me, it would be war. If you blue ticked me, I would phone you and tell you how rude were you to blue tick me.

Tanya Scotece: 23:19

Meaning that they saw your message and they didn't respond?

Shireen Botha: 23:22

Correct, they read the message. They read the message and they didn't respond.

Tanya Scotece: 23:28

Okay, so it's okay. So with that. So your, what was your immediate interpretation that they so that? Let's just go back for a minute. So, on text messaging, that would almost be like a read receipt that people could see it. So what about if somebody let's, let me just play like what they've used the word devil's advocate, right? So, let's say, somebody's in a meeting that happened to see your message and is doing a presentation and they're not able to respond 100%, 100%.

Shireen Botha: 24:01

Like, as I said, you know, nowadays I'm so fine with it, I don't it doesn't bother me at all, but I know it's like you've got to understand that people are at different places. They're at work, there in lectures, you know. Whatever the case maybe, but I do remember a time that it would irritate me, but now it doesn't bother me at all, but yeah, it's just amazing, you get over that. How did you get over that, or get through it? Let's see, I think it was just over time and just growth, I suppose.

Tanya Scotece: 24:39

What was your? What was your initial response? That you were important or you didn't desert. What was it? What would you say like? What bothered you about it?

Shireen Botha: 24:49

I think you know what I think it might have been, because I felt like the person was ignoring me, or that they thought that what I have to say wasn't important. Maybe I mean.

Tanya Scotece: 25:00

whatever the case, yeah, I'm not a psychologist, but that almost sounds like like a core belief Story. Right is this, and now people are kind of fulfilling your belief about yourself.

Shireen Botha: 25:16

Oh, yeah, the problem, the problem wasn't with them, the problem was with me, 100% because, yeah, I think to be heard is one of the major things that I wanted and lacked growing up. And I think again it's so stupid and I'm laughing at myself now because it is.

Tanya Scotece: 25:44

It's stupid, it's embarrassing and I should never because we all have core beliefs, like we all have like what and I'm going to use the word like things that we now can trigger us right.

Voiceover: 25:57

Like the word trigger.

Tanya Scotece: 25:59

I think that stems from my daughter's therapist uses the phrase and I've used it on different podcasts with you before. Yes, there is historical. I'm going to say that again. Hysterical is historical, meaning that if you have a reaction that is so extreme whether it's anger or, you know, complete, just upset, you know, fist clenched or crying or whatever that emotion, usually that default to some core belief that we're working to and we all have.

Tanya Scotece: 26:33

But the interesting part is we have different core beliefs about different things because we're not all there's, I think there's, I think actually there's. I think there's like 10 major core beliefs. But, for example, if your core belief is about not being heard right and mine is about not being good enough, things that are going to trigger me have to do with not being good enough as opposed to being good enough. So it's almost like so that's when you get into, like, the workplace communication. It's like how come we can all hear the same thing from the same person and some people think that's a fine statement and other people are triggered beyond belief. How could they have said that? Who do they think they are right? Like I mean, communication in the workplace is a whole other. You know level of you know just understanding. So that's the week for part two from friends from wild places.