Mastering the Art of People Management

We explore the critical elements that make or break business teams and how proper people management directly impacts company success.

Irma Parone

• Tel: +1 954-464-6689
• Website: ParoneGroup.com
• Email: irma@paronegroup.com
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/paronegroup/

• Most businesses seek help when they're already in crisis mode, realizing teams lack direction or purpose
• Clear expectations are essential—many leaders think employees understand their role when there's actually a significant disconnect
• Rehabilitating struggling employees requires checking three boxes: clear expectations, proper tools/training, and genuine desire to do the work
• Some wonderful people may simply be in the wrong position, like managers who can't hold others accountable
• Remote work creates challenges for team connection—people typically stay at companies because of relationships, not abstract loyalty
• Business growth often stalls because owners fear delegating or hiring someone who won't meet their standards
• Cross-training and development programs prepare employees for different roles, ensuring business continuity and improving retention
• Every position has value—leaders who treat all roles "like the gold they are" create environments where people thrive
• The direct supervisor is the most important person in determining employee satisfaction and success
• The ultimate goal is creating a workplace where employees say "I love this place" rather than considering other offers

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Transcript

Introduction to Friends from Wild Places

Voiceover 0:03

Tales from the wild , stories from the heart . A journey into the mind and soul of fired up business professionals , where they share their vision for the future and hear from a different non-profit organization every month as they create awareness of their goals and their needs . Dive into a world of untamed passion as we join our host , Shireen Botha , for this month's episode of Friends from Wild Places .

Tanya Scotece 0:35

Question . I have a question . So most folks that are hiring you and your services , are they coming to you like in crisis , like we have this team , everybody's going in a different direction and we want to bring everybody on board ? Or are people being more proactive to say , maybe we're a new business or maybe we're looking to have our team get inspired ? So what do you see more out in the real world with your line of work ? Are you helping people in crisis or are you having people be more proactive before things fall apart

Helping Businesses in Crisis

Tanya Scotece 1:07

?

Irma Parone 1:07

Well , generally , they're in crisis Generally . I mean , what happens is they all of a sudden realize they don't know what to do . Yeah , yeah , my biggest customer was promoted to a COO and there were no , and she didn't even know she needed key performance indicators . You know , how do I know who's doing well , what's my team expected to do and how are they doing it , and how do we watch that go up ? There were so many things that needed to be done and she was just lost and I was recommended by one of my customers in the security industry . So , and she did great . I mean , I worked for her for many years until the company was sold , and by a big company who does what I do . But she went from a COO to a president to now CEO . So she's amazing . You know , there are some customers who just don't want to listen or follow the track , but in most cases , unfortunately , it starts when they're in . Oh my gosh , I don't know what to do .

Tanya Scotece 2:17

And , in your opinion , can employees be rehabilitated Like can they be , you know , I mean or do they have to be exited , like ?

Irma Parone 2:38

can they be ? You know , I mean , or do they have to be exited , like what is it ? I mean , I did HR for over 20 years in two different fields medical and mortuary so I'm pretty familiar with people and I don't think they change much

Can Employees Be Rehabilitated?

Irma Parone 2:44

across industries . So what's your lot of a lot of people when they come to me and they say you know , john Doe is a problem and I need to get rid of them , and I'll say well , let's look at it . And I find that there are a few things . Number one is are they very clear , very , very clear on the expectations ? And a lot of employers say , oh , they know what to do , but when I talk to the employee and I talk to the boss and individually and say , tell me the expectation , very often it's different .

Irma Parone 3:17

So , being very clear , knowing what's expected , not just in the job description , not just in you have to do this , but how to do it , you know you could lose a client with one interaction and with today's internet , that interaction , that problem , can be spread across thousands of people . So it's really looking at how am I developing these people so they know how to handle a problem , so they don't upset a customer ? But you know , generally it's . Are they clear on expectations ? Check that box right ? Do they have the tools to do it ? And sometimes it's a matter of helping them with focusing on the right thing . So if they think they're so busy they can't do the major things , then we work on the time management . What is distracting them ? What are those problems and how do we fix those problems so that we put a bandaid on it ? Right , but we also fix the root cause of the problem so that it doesn't continue . So do they have the tools , which is sometimes training . Sometimes it's a computer , you know whatever it is , and then there's learning curve .

Irma Parone 4:28

So just because you teach me something today doesn't mean I'm going to learn , remember it tomorrow . You know I already taught them that . Well , yes , maybe you did , but you taught them a million things and we can only grasp so much stuff . So that's all a part of it . And then do they want to do it ? So some people just don't want to do it and some people are just incapable .

Irma Parone 4:50

For example , when I first took my vice president position , my boss told me you have to get rid of this one manager . And I said you know to myself , look , I've rehabbed a lot of people . I'm not going to just get rid of them , I'm going to work with them . Well , I , this guy , was so wonderful , so kind , so caring , he was so engaged , but you know what ? He couldn't hold people accountable . He just couldn't do it . He was in the wrong role and I left him in it too long . So it's not like I haven't made the same mistake , but some people are just not meant for the job or just don't want to do the work . So that's kind of how I look at things .

Tanya Scotece 5:31

Right , right , right . And I don't want to . I want to go back for a minute because I don't want to go too far forward without taking a step back . So first of all , can you share about your experience that's an amazing achievement with Cornell . You know your studies there as far as

Education and Experience at Cornell

Tanya Scotece 5:46

what was that like and you know what . What area of studies did you do that now have helped you in your business ?

Irma Parone 5:53

Well , the reason that they sent me there was because they wanted me in a labor relations role , which it was a . Back then I was in nuclear security , so security guards in nuclear power stations providing the security there , and I worked and they were union sites . And my boss wanted me in this role because he said I was very good at looking both sides of an issue . You know , a lot of times union and management just fight . Well , that doesn't fix things . Fighting doesn't fix things , it's finding out what we need to do . So I said you know , not that I wouldn't like to do it , but I don't like to fail and I don't know what the heck . You know , I don't know anything about labor law and stuff like that . So it really helped me in that role . We did a lot of amazing things with the union . We really worked together . It took some time but you know , just understanding labor in a more official way certainly helps in any role you're in .

Tanya Scotece 6:59

Very nice , very nice . And I have one more question . Then I'll turn it back over to Shereen . From your experience , you know , over the years we've seen , or I've seen , I should say , some transition , with companies , for example , making , let's say , like , obviously , with the pandemic period going virtual right . So a lot of the businesses transitioned virtual . Then emerging out of the pandemic , it's like some went back fully in person , others went hybrid , others created more of an ambient or atmosphere that's more productive . I remember I think it was actually Google and Amazon , companies that had a very strategic , like you know , little pods for people to rest and coffee stations and things like that . Rest and coffee stations and things like that , what's your take over ? Your evolving into your own business and , having come from you know really good studies and things , what is that doing ? The culture , I would say that , that different culture , and how are people achieving that in the virtual

Virtual Work and Company Culture

Tanya Scotece 7:58

world ? Now it's it's rough .

Irma Parone 8:01

So if you have , if if you do have virtual and you you can't get away from it , then try to have them come in and work . So much People need to connect with other people . Most people stay because of their connections , even if they love their company . How do they know their company ? I had one client whose employee left and when I talked to them because I try to dig into why they're leaving and stuff , and I said , well , tell me about your company . Well , a company is the person , right ?

Irma Parone 8:38

So Apple is a company , but people don't know an Apple . They know who they worked for , that's who represents the company . They know who they work with . They make those connections and there's a lot that happens when you're together . So the way I handle it with customers that have virtual , you know , let people work all virtual is have a lot of activities together , make memorable events so that they connect with each other and they get to know each other and they have fun in you know , not just work , but get them together , have some work stuff and have a lot of play time so that they can connect . So I hope did that answer your question .

Tanya Scotece 9:23

Yeah , yeah , most definitely , most definitely , yeah , thank you .

Shireen Botha 9:26

I'm learning a lot , oma , because I mean , you're very good at what you do and I'm sitting here and listening , I'm taking notes , so I appreciate everything that you're chatting about today . Uh , going back to just you and your journey as a business owner , what would you say has been one of the biggest lessons that you've learned and how you've gotten over that as a business owner ?

Irma Parone 9:56

Well , that really came in stages right . There's different lessons as you grow your business . So the first one was , I think , understanding that you could win the battle but still lose the war . So and I guess this problem that probably was more when I was in labor relations , working for another company . So that might not be a fair one , but it's still an important thing to learn . So if , for example , if you're working with unions , you can win all the arbitrations right , you can come out as

Lessons Learned as a Business Owner

Irma Parone 10:37

the winner and then have people who hate you . So it's not just what you think is important , but what really is important . Again , where you don't underestimate marketing . You know people . I don't care how good I am doesn't matter . If nobody knows about me , then what good is it ? I mean , you know I'm not going to get out there . And then the people side of the business is so important . I don't care if you have one employee . You really need to love them . And I say love , it's an emotion , but they need to love you , they . I'll give you a quick thing .

Irma Parone 11:26

So I have people that call me a lot and say you know , gee , I think I'm hiring the wrong person . And I talk about this in my speeches and when we're looking at problem solving . And so when I look into it because I'll do some research , they give me permission to contact the people that left . They say you know , I bring them in , I train them and then they're gone . Well , when I did the research , some of them hired poorly . I'll give you that , but in most cases that wasn't the problem . If you hire me and my resume's out there , there are still other people calling me . So we changed their problem from how do I hire better to how do I retain new hires , and the goal is I always tell clients your goal should be that they go home and say I love that place and if other people call them for a job , they say nope , I found something other than well , what are you paying ? So I hope that answered your question .

Shireen Botha 12:34

This is very good . This is all very good because for me , I'm a one-man band . I have been for years now and I think my biggest chat and I know the times come in when I'm going to have to hire my first employee but I've got to be honest . I think my biggest struggle that I had to get over first is the difficulty of trusting another person to do as good of a job as I can do . So that trust first of all , and the other thing is is I'm always scared of hiring the wrong person , like I wouldn't want someone that's got the wrong intentions in .

Shireen Botha 13:16

You know , in my business is trying to capture my clients and then result . I've heard horror stories , horror stories of employees , just other business owners hiring not the best employees . But I love what you said , irma . I do want to do that , though . I want to create a space for my employees to feel loved and feel appreciated and valued , and I want them to feel like they . They don't want to leave because of the environment that I've created for them . So I I like what you're saying and I hope I can tell you , a lot of people hold themselves back because they are .

Irma Parone 14:07

They have the same fears that you do , so you're not alone . But you just can't grow until you . Until you do that , how much can you grow without killing yourself and working , you know , 84 hours a day ? So there are ways to um , there's no guarantees . Of course you can hire somebody that's really good at pulling things over you , but there are . I mean I , one of my partners , is somebody who does background screening . She worked in the nuclear industry that's how I knew her , so and she's very affordable .

Irma Parone 14:41

So , making sure you do background screening and how you interview them and how you get references , I mean a lot of employers won't give information right . They're afraid of being sued . But I have ways of . You know , I want to know anybody who will talk to me about them , whether they were a coworker and you wouldn't believe . Poor employees think they have friends

Addressing Workplace Training Issues

Irma Parone 15:03

and they don't . You can get a lot of information . But you know I loved my one boss so much and he really gave me a lot of the basis for my high value employee focus and when I left him I was recruited away . I gave him a two month notice and the company that hired me said I can't wait for two months . I said I'm sorry , then I'm not coming , and they gave me the leniency to do that because I loved him . I still do . We're still good friends . So there are ways to get past some of that stuff , and some of it is accepting that everything won't be exactly the way you do it , but some of it might be better . That's true .

Shireen Botha 15:53

It's the control . I guess hey , like , yeah , control it's being a business owner . You've got control of your business . So it's that handing over the part of your business that you've been doing for such a long time that you know you're doing excellently and your clients love it about your business . But it's that trust and that letting the move , control and going okay , I'm gonna trust you . I've trained you enough . Now I think you can do this and just you know , right , right you can do it .

Irma Parone 16:25

You can do it , I'm sure of it .

Tanya Scotece 16:27

I have some , just an area that I want to explore a little bit with you . So , from where I sit in my current position working with students , I hear a lot and see about lack of training in the workplace , right ? Or being trained by somebody that doesn't have your best interest in mind . That doesn't have your best interest in mind . So , for example and there's been some research that looking into as far as , like , bullying in the workforce Okay , so meaning that like , let's say , you have somebody that's leaving a position because it no longer suits that person and now they are in charge of training the new person , they may not want that company to be successful , they may not want that person to be successful . So what , and if any , recommendations on that side of things that maybe some businesses that are listening to this podcast , right , like the owners or managers , should be aware of to say , and maybe having the person that's leaving train the new person may not be the best interest of the company or for the potential of the new hire .

Irma Parone 17:33

So we have egos right . If I leave a position , I should care about the company and the employee taking over , but I might feel like , well , gee , I want them to miss me , so I'm not going to do this . My suggestion is to really reverse the way you're working it and work on a growth and development program . So start having people prepare for the next role , if they're interested in certain roles . Just develop a little bit work with that person , work with each other so that they're learning different jobs , so that you at least can continue your business if that person leaves .

Irma Parone 18:23

Some people don't even give a notice , which is , you know , death by suicide . I mean , it's crazy , but there are people who don't even give you that notice . So I would not give somebody who was leaving unless I knew them well , that job . I would work on a growth and development plan to get people prepared so that they can learn different skills . And that also helps with employee retention , because employees like to know that there's some growth capability and it shows them that you care about them , that you want them to grow in the company . So there's a lot of different reasons that I recommend that .

Tanya Scotece 19:06

Right , the company . So there's a lot of different reasons that I recommend that Right . It's almost like it seems like from what I'm taking away if I'm , if I can share , it is it seems like cross training , but but but much deeper and and not just covering for the day or covering for somebody's vacation or company's , somebody's maternity

Keys to Employee Retention

Tanya Scotece 19:24

leave or something like that , but really understanding the mission or vision of the company to be able to assume other positions , growth roles and potential future happier employees . Right , is that what I'm getting at ?

Irma Parone 19:38

And it's actually putting them in the role . So working with someone , if I need an accountant right and somebody's interested in accounting , accountant right and somebody's interested in accounting , then little splurts of , but scheduled , you know an actual program where I can work with that person and learn a strategic pathway little by little . You know not to interrupt my job too much and then you know teach them . When I work with companies on training their employees , it's not just a matter of teaching them because , as I said , there's a lot of learning curve right , teaching them , letting them watch you . You watch them right , you put them in the role and then , when you feel confident that they can do the job , then give them a little project here and there . So it really prepares people and it makes it interesting .

Tanya Scotece 20:34

Right , right , and do you find with your services I mean , can you come into a company and turn it around and then have them have their own tools to move forward , or do you quote unquote , have to be on retainer for them ? Or is that part of you know your like proposed package ? I would say for the company , like , are you always with them or are they okay to go ?

Irma Parone 20:56

yeah , so if if I'm doing my job well , they should be able to fire me , because they don't need me anymore that's a that motto and a half .

Tanya Scotece 21:05

Irma , you're like if I do my job well , I expect to be fired .

Irma Parone 21:12

But what happens is yeah , but there's always problems here and there . So what happens is and I just charge hourly so you could use me as much or as little . You know I'm not one of these people that say you have to pay me $50,000 a month , no , but as they have turnover and things , you know they still usually maybe once a month we'll do a , you know , even just a Q&A . You know , like office hours I'll be available for certain hours that your supervisors can come on or whoever and ask questions or things like that . So usually they stay with me . Except you know this one company . I mean they have this whole other . You know this big company that has pretty much , but I still hear from my client .

Tanya Scotece 22:00

Yeah , yeah . And what would you say are the like if you had to give top three reasons bulk them together , lump them together . Cross cultures , big and small businesses , thousands of employees , two employees I've always heard the expression back in the day . It was like if you have one employee , you have an HR issue . So what are the three main areas that you feel really are the top three areas for companies struggling or with employees , is it ? Let me just give you some examples Like would it be , you know , not feeling appreciated ? Would it be not being trained ? Would it be no communication with higher administration ? What , from your everything that you've seen , cross-culture companies ? What would your top three be ? Everything that you've seen cross-culture companies .

Irma Parone 22:48

What would your top three be ? Well , your direct supervisor is the most important person that that company needs to focus on , because if I work for you , doesn't matter what the CEO does . You're the one that's going to train me , or make sure I get trained . Protect me against the big bad wolves up in corporate right , because there's a lot of pressure . The higher you go in an organization , the more pressure there is and the more focus on the bottom line . So you have to meet that bottom line . But it's how you do it and that immediate supervisor is the most important person for that , for each employee .

Irma Parone 23:29

The other thing is having a clear chain of command . You know making sure that if I report to three people and they're all over the place , it just is confusing . Who's holding me accountable ? Usually it's nobody , right , god ? There's so many things , I don't know how to pick three . But it's really getting people to love you . I don't mean , by being giving care of them , even if that means hard conversations , making them know how appreciated they are . I had a guy who I wouldn't work for . When he talked to me about his employee , he said you know , I told this employee a monkey can do your job . How can you screw it up ? How do you feel when somebody says a monkey can do your job ? Every single role in an organization has a critical piece to it , every single one .

Irma Parone 24:38

If you're in payroll and people don't get paid , that's a problem . If you're in customer service and those customers aren't taken great care of , that's a problem . If you're in sales and you're in customer service and those customers aren't taken great care of , that's a problem . If you're in sales and you're not growing the company , that's a problem . So it's not a matter of one , it's a matter of do you need these positions ? And if you do , you treat them all like the gold they are .

Shireen Botha 25:03

Tune in next week for part three of Friends from Wild Places . Tune in next week for part three of Friends from Wild Places .

Voiceover 25:08

You've been listening to Friends from Wild Places with Shireen Botha . Be sure to subscribe to the podcast from the links to catch every episode and unleash your passion .